64bit version of GameCore?

[PuckerFactor]

I was wondering if you will have a 64bit version of GameCore? ...As you already know, making huge outdoor maps requires more memory and most 32bit apps can only access 2GB of memory.

If not, did you write your 32bit version of GameCore with the /largeaddressaware switch which can then access more than the standard 2GB?

I have 8GB of memory on 64bit Vista, which enables me to make huge maps in 64bit Sandbox2 for Crysis. Some of my team members running Windows 32bit cannot create these maps in the Sandbox editor. I was wondering if I would run into the same problem with GameCore?

[DPF]

Good point, interesting.

I guess that when more of the target audience or customers are running Vista 64bit, then a 64bit Gamecore will be necessary to boost everything up to what people expect to see.

Or if you are using the Gamecore engine to render realtime visualizations for output or capture, then  you need 64bit Gamecore, or a largeaddressaware version that you mention anytime now.

I use BV1.1 on a XP64 system with Nvidia 64bit drivers, so that helps a lot for pushing the display for real-time capture.

As far as exporting levels, you still have to consider the system or customer you're distributing to.

[pixel_legolas]

I have 8GB of memory on 64bit Vista, which enables me to make huge maps in 64bit Sandbox2 for Crysis. Some of my team members running Windows 32bit cannot create these maps in the Sandbox editor.

Isn't this the big problem. Most people don't have more than 2gb ram and don't know about 32bit or 64bit. People just want to play that "really nice looking game". We have had discussions before about what audience to target and it is really hard when you sit with a super-comp while the most avarage comp out there is porbably not so super

[PuckerFactor]

Isn't this the big problem. Most people don't have more than 2gb ram and don't know about 32bit or 64bit. People just want to play that "really nice looking game". We have had discussions before about what audience to target and it is really hard when you sit with a super-comp while the most avarage comp out there is porbably not so super

Er ...when were you thinking of completing your game? ...next week?...because if you were... then maybe you'd have a point.

You need to sit down again and ask your audience what hardware they will be running 2 years from now, because that's probably when any serious game project you start now will be ready. My team are not looking at current hardware now...We are creating something for future hardware to run. Also creating maps now with the 64bit tools and 8Gbs of memory is different than playing them in-game a couple of years from now.

Most people that don't have more than 2Gb of ram or know anything about 32bit or 64bit ...will never make a retail game. My statement regarding this was about the tools needed to make the game ...not play it.

[ANDROMEDA FRAME]

Not to mention any "serious" gamer will have a machine that runs not only vista with with a minimum of 3 gigs of ddr2, possibly even ddr3, with an extreme quad core, and a dx10 capable video card now, who knows what kind of machine will be available 2 years from now. If you look at it that way (and you should), Pucker has the right idea.
If, on the other hand,  you are going for the quick buck (and you aren't alone there, that's why most video games are just a rehash of the same tired crap that has been put out so many times before), then by all means go for the greatest common denominator. Make another boring race game or FPS while you're at it, since there are just not enough of those out there.......................

[pixel_legolas]

Well i myself is a pro gamer and have good specs but it's also very hard to plan a game for future hardware because you have no idea what it will be. I just saw dx11 announcement and such and it makes it hard. But of course. If you push your current system to the max it will probably runs smoothly on most computers in 2-3 years.

But there are still many people today with 512mb ram and 128mb internal graphics. People should make games for them too

[ANDROMEDA FRAME]

At the risk of sounding elitist, I'd say if you are running 512 mb of ram you probably shouldn't be wasting your time playing games. You should be out trying to get a job so you can afford the paltry 60 bux it costs to drop 2 gigs of ram in your machine. The only people I know who run glorified calculators like that don't game with them. They use it for surfing the net and checking their email. And they continually tell me they think they have a virus because it runs real slow.............
No, anyone with a machine like that is likely not playing games on it, and if they are, well, too bad. They most likely won't appreciate the time and effort you put into making it look awesome, for the simple fact that they are most likely running a 14-15" crt as well, and it will look like garbage anyway.
Personally I'd rather make games for the "avid" gamer, not the people who enjoy playing Sim City 3 on it's lowest settings. They are not the type of gamer who goes out and buy's new games, or technology for that matter. A lot of them still run Windows 98, bless their little troglodyte hearts.
How do I know this?
Because I work with, and am acquainted with about a dozen of these types. I choose to make the profit I do from these folks (1 bottle of Glenfiddich per visit), by keeping these antiques running. When told I could bulid them a new machine that would be ten times better for around $400, they always say, "No, I don't really need that, I just need to open my email, etc...".
So, as much as I respect your opinion on many things P.L., I have to disagree with you on this.

[pixel_legolas]

I totally understand your point and i also want to create next-gen games. But there is still a huge mass that just want to play some classic mini-golf

My specs are as follows:

Athlon dual core 5400+, 2,8GHz
2GB ram
Geforce 8800GTS, 640Mb (i think)
and total of 980Gb HHD

Not the best but still runs most games smoothly. I want to create something that is visually stimulating and should be run on high graphics but i still make a small tear when thinking of thos people who just are lazy or don't afford a better comp

[Jim]

If, on the other hand,  you are going for the quick buck (and you aren't alone there, that's why most video games are just a rehash of the same tired crap that has been put out so many times before), then by all means go for the greatest common denominator. Make another boring race game or FPS while you're at it, since there are just not enough of those out there.......................

Isn't it usually "the same tired crap" that you get when your goal is to push the hardware visually... Granted it will be shiny pretty tired crap... There are tonnes of different target audiences while developing games, and yes your desired target of pushing the graphics as hard as you can is one, but that is definitely not the only demographic... Especially in the indie development crowd, casual games can be a good choice for a target...

I don't know the answer to the original question, but GameCore has come a long way in a short time since Beyond Virtual's original release, and I bet it is going to keep growing and evolving. 

[ANDROMEDA FRAME]

You shed tears for lazy people? What are you, a nun (I follow them around at work mocking them, while still managing to get all my duties done)?
There are already tons of "classic" games out there like mini golf. Why would these "lazy people" bother with your version of it?
They are by definition incapable of trying something new or even finding it because of their "condition".
Do you see my point?

Isn't it usually "the same tired crap" that you get when your goal is to push the hardware visually... Granted it will be shiny pretty tired crap... There are tonnes of different target audiences while developing games, and yes your desired target of pushing the graphics as hard as you can is one, but that is definitely not the only demographic... Especially in the indie development crowd, casual games can be a good choice for a target...

If you are building yet another FPS, racing game, etc. then yes. If you have an original idea and are pushing the graphics to their limit then, no. You can do casual games with a twist, I suppose, but you are still beating a dead horse.
Then again, if you choose to be lazy and make a game someone else already made for somebody who has already played it but wants to collect every version out there, be my guest. I just don't think it adds to the big quilt of creativity. Just the big quilt of mediocrity......
The independent game scene should be as (or more so) vibrant as the indie music scene. If I want friggin' Nickelback or Britney spears I can get them (and all their xerox versions in spades) from the mainstream.
So goes that if I want 5 versions of the same overpriced hockey game, with graphics and features that improve only a minute amount with each release even though the company has billions$$$ in resources, I'll go to EA.
It should be up to us to create the next new thing, not wallow in irrelevency.
Which is what you end up doing by being "lazy" yourself and catering to the drones out there who get their information and guidance from "thu teevee".

[Jim]

I have no idea what you are talking about man... You seem to contradict yourself and are not really making any point so much as attempting to insult people...

[ANDROMEDA FRAME]

Where is the contradiction and who am I insulting? 

[hikmayan]

OK!....
It's true that making huge outdoor maps requires more memory and most 32bit apps can only access 2GB of memory.When you think about it my friend,32/64bit either get the Job done depending on the type of map in question...there are always "options".Hug outdoor maps  have been done w/32bit in the past...nothing new!;there are many ways to get stuff done. Now, 64bit as I understand it in general;The operating systems for those 64-bit architectures generally support both 32-bit and 64-bit applications. In x86-64 architecture (AMD64), the majority of the 32-bit operating systems and applications are able to run smoothly on the 64-bit hardware...Typical misconception is that 64-bit architectures are no better than 32-bit architectures unless the computer has more than 4 GB of memory. This is not entirely true. Correct me if I am going "south west" with this subject.I don't buy that from anyone. I am not sure how "Mike" will address this question but there is hope that "GC" will operational in a 64bit. I am building a 64bit PC but will keep my 32bit.

Look; The main disadvantage of 64-bit architectures is that relative to 32-bit architectures the same data occupies more space in memory (due to swollen pointers and possibly other types and alignment padding). This increases the memory requirements of a given process and can have implications for efficient processor cache utilization. Maintaining a partial 32-bit model is one way to handle this and is in general reasonably effective. The main advantage to 64-bit version  is the ability to access more registers in the x86-64 architecture that's it and yeah!...it's a good thing. There is no need to call names "lazy and what not...the question you asked was cleared enough..."a 64bit version of GameCore"..that's it....Peace my friend.

[ANDROMEDA FRAME]

I could care less about 64 bit. The point was if you think making another super simple game for some troglodyte with a 1.4 cpu and 512 mg of ram then you are just as lazy as they are for not upgrading to even the most obsolete 3 gig cpu 2 gig ram system. If this offends you well to f'ing bad my friend, because you are obsolete as well. My point was, as independent gamers we should be leading the pack, not pulling up the rear with bad versions of what has already been done. If this offends you, well ...........good. It should. It offends me as well....That`s why I try to be cutting edge, and I dare say why P.F. is cutting edge. Go ahead and and make a golf game, why not make a game where a frog tries to cross a busy highway too.....
Perhaps those of you who fancy yourselves gamebuilders should take a look out there at what is really going on....
I am not contradicting myself, as I am pretty damn sure of what I am saying so perhaps reread it, absorb it, and get back to me when you understand it.
I am not insulting anybody or attempting to insult anyone (you will know it when it happens, trust me). I am calling you out on your bullshit.
I do not care if you are a moderator Jim, and I will call you out too. 22 years old and you think you know everything. If you had as much experience as you espouse , you would not be so obtuse.
Bottom line: You are doiing something cutting edge or you are covering ground that someone else has already covered (i.e. sloppy seconds). This engine has the potential to be something fantastic....do it a favour by not soiling it with half assery......

[hikmayan]

ANDROMEDA FRAME

Peace my friend...there is no need to get upset man. You made your point and let it go man. Please let's keep the energy of this forum calm.We can learn from each other better.We are all like a big family trying to help one another.Peace please.....peace.